The junk carried after carrying junk for a long time...... And other random thoughts.

Discussion in 'Personal EDC' started by A4VC, Feb 2, 2016.

  1. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    Hey all, here's a list of the stuff that I carry. This list has been screwed around with for a long, long, loooonnnnng, time and after that length of time, this seems to work for me. Keep in mind, I'm "That" guy. You know, the one who could break an anvil? Anyway, my brother in law was recently giving my a ration of BS for carrying this stuff every day on a family vacation, but was then asking to borrow stuff all the time. We had to fix a heater in the house we were staying in. No problem, have a flashlight and a screwdriver right here. What, you need a pen and paper to write something down? Here you go bro..... You tore a fingernail? Here's some small scissors to do some good old fashioned field surgery with. Tweezers? Got it. Someone's breaking into the car outside? Call 911, here's a phone. The gun? It's here to defend against personal attack, not property crimes. The lightbulb burned out in the basement? Here's a flashlight. In reality, all this junk is not the nicest stuff in the world by any means but it's all serviceable and has withstood the test of time. On to the list.

    Firearm, either a G19 or a G17. The reason I usually carry a Glock is that they are super dependable, next to indestructible, the most reliable I've found, and if forced to use it, or it gets destroyed (Notice I said "Next to indestructible"), it can be replaced without too much fanfare and without breaking the bank. Trust me on this, I literally destroyed a 1911 once. Others will disagree and that's fine, carry what your bank account will bear and what you're comfortable with. The tupperware works for me. Along with the aforementioned combat tupperware goes 2 magazines. That way, in just about any worst case scenario, I can make the thing go bang at least 3 times. I also use a weapon mounted light. Currently, I use a Surefire X300 but will switch to the XC1 when I get some holsters made. Plenty of light and Surefire's work, every time. I've had some really bad experiences with other manufacturers in the weapons light industry. Never had a problem with a Surefire. (No they're not paying me to say this. See the next paragraph.)

    Flashlight. If you carry a firearm, which I do, a flashlight must be part of my kit, in my opinion. The reason for this, and after many years of carrying a firearm professionally, is it's not always 72 degrees out, with the sun shining and at your back. You can go from outside to inside and be almost totally blind. That's the "Tacticool" reason, but it's also dark half the time. If you're serious about defending yourself, you need to be able to defend yourself in court also so a flashlight is mandatory. If you don't carry a firearm, a flashlight is a really handy and easy device to carry around. I usually have a 4Sevens Quark Tactical. The one that holds 1 CR123 battery. They don't make it any more but it the the most handy light I've ever had. It's plenty bright for all but the most extreme situations and even when I had a 2 cell light on my belt, the 1 cell would be in my pocket or clipped to my vest for a backup. I used that backup often. Why a 4Sevens instead of the previously mentioned Surefire? Economy. Surefire charges an arm and a leg for their stuff and the 4Sevens was just as durable, performed just as well, and at a fraction of the cost. It's all beat up and nasty looking now after years of service. It's been dropped, lost, found, rolled around the floor of my car for days on end before being relocated, and it just keep on going. It will never be replaced until it is lost for good or I manage to really break it.

    Pen and paper. Again, no fanfare there. Usually a Molskine or Field Notes pad. They're relatively cheap and flat. The pen I use is a modded F-701 with other guts in it to make it all stainless and with a SpacePen refill. It doesn't freeze, it looks nice, it's comfortable to write with and inexpensive, but kind of nice at the same time.

    A watch. Yes, it's kind of old fashioned but it's something that was required at a time in my life and have kind of stuck with it. This is where I'll splurge a wee bit and as some of you on here know, I have a few. No Rolex's or Omega's for me. I've always wanted a Submariner but a former Soldier and Retired Cop can't afford such luxuries. Almost all my watches, except a couple of Casio's I've hung on to, are automatics. It's a vice I have, I know that Quartz watches are almost always more accurate, but I have a thing for the old school awesomeness of a micro-machine that has remained relatively unchanged for hundreds of years. The engineering is wonderful and I never have to change batteries or have the batteries die out at the exact wrong moment, which happened to me once. Sure, you have to have them serviced every so often but since I can't afford high end watches, every 15 or 20 years will do.

    Knife: I always have a pocket folder on a clip. For that, normally a Spyderco PM2. Fairly inexpensive and not too much fanfare. If I loose it, break the tip doing something I'm not supposed to with it, or abusing it in some other way, the tears are kept to a minimum and it can be replaced quickly and easily. I also carry an ALOX Cadet on a dangler and/or a SAK Climber. I also have a small glasses sized screwdriver in the corkscrew. Have I ever used the corkscrew you ask? You bet! Not that I'm personally a wine drinker but was at a work party with my spouse and they didn't have a corkscrew for their "Wine tasting." Armed with my redneck Coors Light, I was all, "I got this!" Problem solved, problem staying solved. The ladies were happy drinking their wine that didn't come from a box and they were going, "Why don't you carry something like that?" to their respective spouses. I was then forced to ask, "Why don't YOU have something like that with that 50 pound bag of farding material you have strapped over your shoulder?" as I took another pull from my redneck Coors Light. Yup, I'm an A-hole. Again, if I loose my SAK, it's either a short trip to wherever to replace it, or there's a couple laying around the house, and it won't break the bank OR make me cry crocodile tears.

    Next on the list is a wedding band. Nothing fancy, just a $12.00 hunk of titanium. It's all scratched to heck and beat up but I like it. The household 6 recently asked if I wanted a nicer wedding band. Had to tell her, "No thanks, this one serves the purpose to mark me as a married man and if I scratch it REALLY bad, a piece of sandpaper or steel wool will fix it." A really cool one out of damascus steel would be nice though. Maybe I should have told her yes?

    Wallet: A buddy of mine is into making things of Kydex. He made me two small wallets of Kydex that hold exactly what I need and nothing more. I was that guy that would end up with a wallet that would stretch to 2" thick. Every so often I'd go through the thing and it was mostly pocket trash. Now I have a couple of cards, some membership cards, and that's about all I need. Helps keep me more organized.

    Glasses: Can't see without them. Bifocals. Along with these, a microfiber cloth to clean them and my watch with.

    Cash: I always have a quantity of cash on hand. Not a gagillion dollars but enough to get home with. Carry it in my front pocket with a money clip equipped with a bottle opener and screwdriver. I also carry 2 Silver Eagles. Probably because my dad did. Never used them, just kind of a talisman. Never learned why my Dad carried them either. Should have asked him, never got the chance.

    Challenge Coin: I've had the same challenge coin since 1986. I earned it so sticking with it. It's served me well this far so why change?

    Lighter. Bic.....wrapped with a foot or so of 100mph tape re-wrapped around it. No, not a smoker but don't know how many times people have asked me if I had fire for whatever reason or a piece of tape to make a quick repair to something. The Bic is inexpensive, dependable, small, lightweight, lasts a long time, and is maintenance free. Double it with some Gorilla tape, 100mph tape, or duct tape and it serves two purposes. If it's lost, who cares? $0.99 at a convenience store and back in business.

    Copenhagen: Long cut. Can't live without it. Yeah, it's nasty as heck, but no one has to smell it and if they can, they're too darn close to me and fixing to get moved back a few feet. No, couldn't live somewhere like NYC. Too cramped, too close together, and too many people in your space.

    Cell phone. iPhone 6. In a Lifeproof case. Yes, I live in the desert so why a Lifeproof case you ask. It rains, it snows, the dust is EVERYWHERE, and I have also been submerged in water......in the desert. Destroyed a phone or two that way. Yes, there are some really cool other cases out there, even one that will protect your phone from a direct hit with a .50BMG. Well, not really, the shock will still destroy the phone but there won't be a hole in it. Why not a cooler case then you ask. The Lifeproof ones just work for me. They're slim enough to still fit in my pocket and protect the phone enough that it doesn't break, usually, knock on wood, when I drop it in the gravel, on pavement, or in the toilet. My son actually submerged his phone in about 4' of water for about an hour and the phone was fine. I'm sold.

    Ear Protection. Yes, I always have some orange foam ear protection in my pocket. Never know when you're going to be out in the middle of nowhere and have an impromptu range session.

    So there, that's it. That's my every day carry crap. Don't have the cool brass stuff, the super nice flashlights, the ubër expensive pistols, lighters, knives, or stuff like that. Don't get me wrong, it would be nice to have them but can't justify the expenditure on my pension. Maybe I'll have to get a little part time job to start amassing that stuff. NAAAAAA......I'd rather go play on the llano, in the mountains or bosque, and screw off all the time! Sometimes I add a 550 cord bracelet with some ferro rod woven in, I have a small backpack that I carry some other stuff in too, but not every day. I'm sitting here writing this in the comfort of my own home and all that stuff is on my person. If you were patient enough to read through all this garbage, feel free to comment on what could be added or removed to make a day go by easier. I'll toss in some photos soon.
     
    #1 A4VC, Feb 2, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2016
    ArnieJB, Firefly, Jack and 17 others like this.
  2. Lou_G

    Lou_G
    Expand Collapse
    Fratris mei custos sum.
    Staff Member Global Mod

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Messages:
    999
    Likes Received:
    5,387
    Do you keep any kind of trauma or first aid supplies on your person or nearby in a bag?

    Thanks for reminding me, I keep forgetting to wrap some gorilla tape around something and carry it with me.

    It may not be a Submariner, but that SARG007 is one of my favorite watches to look at. :D
     
    Firefly, Jack, GiraffeHooves and 10 others like this.
  3. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    @Lou_G I have a trauma kit and a booboo kit in a go-bag but not on my person. That's a really good idea though to put together a small booboo kit in something like my kydex wallet, maybe smaller. Thanks for the props on the watch, would still love a no date, older vintage Sub! Never happen though......unless I win the lottery!
     
    kye4some, Firefly, Jack and 13 others like this.
  4. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
  5. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    @Lou_G what would you put in a boo boo kit? How big would you want it to be? Anyone else with ideas on this? Bandaids, molskin, maybe some glue and a couple of 2X4's, Tape, antibiotic ointment, anything else come to mind?
     
    #5 A4VC, Feb 2, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2016
    Firefly, Jack, Piejo and 11 others like this.
  6. Kerberos

    Kerberos
    Expand Collapse
    Semper Fidelis

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    1,864
    Great...

    Who called the cops?

    ;)

    Good to see you here brother.
     
  7. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    @Kerberos Great to see you too Marine! BTW, the Jeep is still running like a champ! So is the one the Submarine Commander sunk!
     
    Jack, SMAJ, Ben Rubinstein and 9 others like this.
  8. Kerberos

    Kerberos
    Expand Collapse
    Semper Fidelis

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    1,864
    Good to hear...

    Just don't forget if the gremlins ever pay it a visit make sure and put a bug in my ear before some nOoB tries to sell you a new PCM and wiring harness to fix what's not broken.
     
  9. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    Absolutely!
     
  10. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
  11. Gallows

    Gallows
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Grand Master

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2013
    Messages:
    1,860
    Likes Received:
    15,544
    Great explanation of what you carry and why.
     
  12. madlag

    madlag
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Master

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2016
    Messages:
    830
    Likes Received:
    8,707
    Best thread intro yet:)
     
  13. Lou_G

    Lou_G
    Expand Collapse
    Fratris mei custos sum.
    Staff Member Global Mod

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2014
    Messages:
    999
    Likes Received:
    5,387
    I'll do my medical kits dump in my thread tomorrow and tag you when I post it. Nothing special, but it will give everyone ideas and I might get some valuable feedback.
     
  14. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    Groovy! Should be a great read!
     
  15. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
  16. A4VC

    A4VC
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Scholar

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    1,649
    Bums, hobos and vagabonds.

    @Ben Rubinstein recently posted about his plan, and environment, for getting out of the area should things get rough. Well, rougher than they are day to day for someone that lives where he does, under threat from 3 out of 4 sides, every day, of every year. Ben obviously has given this a lot of thought, has excellent ideas and a damn good plan, and brings up many excellent points about fitting in. This got me to thinking about people that rely on their gear from day to day. In my past profession, I was routinely coming into contact with people who were homeless. A few of them were homeless due to falling on bad times, many were drunkards, addicted to drugs, or were mentally ill and self medicating with street drugs, and others were on the run, either from the law or from something or someone else like family or whatever. There is, however, a very small subculture that I identified that didn't fall into one of these categories. The only way I could describe them is they were old school bums, hobos and vagabonds. Not the schmuck's that beg for money at a street light and then disappear into their brand new Dodge Diesel Pickup truck and make more money begging than many of us do who work, but real, honest to goodness bums, hobos and vagabonds.

    First, definitions, and how I came to my definitions. A bum is a homeless person, who chooses to be homeless, who is usually an alcoholic or other drug user, who will eat trash out of a trashcan, begs for money, and is sometimes rather forceful when begging for money. They have no shame, and will not work. Ever. A vagabond will work, if absolutely necessary, is usually an alcoholic, but will not beg, nor will they eat from a trashcan. A hobo, the true practitioner of homelessness, is completely self sufficient. They will usually accept charity if offered but will never ask for it or harass someone for it. Hobos are not alcoholics or drug users. They just usually opt out of what mainstream society deems "Normal." These are not my definitions, so how did I come to these definitions you ask? They were given to me by a self professed Vagabond. Once, a long time ago (in the 70's), in a land far away (a very liberal university with a large quantity of homeless people about) when I was a kid, my family was visiting my sister where she was going to university and a self professed Vagabond approached my father and I. He proceeded to chat us up, probably looking for a handout, while explaining to us his lot in life. He provided the definitions above. I'll take his definitions as he lived the lifestyle, so should know what he's talking about. He is the expert. For whatever reason, this conversation stuck with me.

    There is one such type that I met professionally before I retired whom I still see on a regular basis. He's a hobo who just opted out of mainstream society. This gentleman, who's real name I will not post, but who everyone calls "Smokey" is just such an individual. I've only met 3 people like this in my life.

    Smokey is not a gang moniker, not due to him smoking tobacco or other illicit substance, but got tagged with the name mainly because he always smells like a camp fire, specifically wood or a coal. What an interesting fellow! I know a bit about his history and he's not a criminal, dangerous, mentally ill, destitute by any means, but he just decided to be (almost) completely off the grid and do his own thing. And now on to the crux of this longwinded rant.

    Smokey is an absolute EDC SUPREME ULTIMATE MASTER! He currently lives under a bridge and basically walks a route daily to collect the things he needs. His one vice? McDonald's coffee. Every day, between 1130 and 1230 he strolls into Chez Mac's and orders a medium cup of coffee, black, no sugar or sweetener. He always gets looks, people make comments and wrinkle their noses, and sit far away from him. Often you hear comments about him. What I can't figure out about people, is if they see him anywhere else, he's completely invisible to them but in the high falutin' environment of an upscale restaurant such as McDonald's, people really seem to notice him. He's clean, doesn't smell like feet or ass, and he's healthy, and he's never, to my knowledge, ever been accused, arrested, or suspected of a crime (except trespassing on public property or along the railroad tracks.) That's how I met him. Some people were playing around on the Bosque and they saw Smokey had his camp up under the bridge, and OH MY GOD! There's some homeless person under the bridge where they wanted to be! Well, got the call, sorted it out, and through this encounter, met Smokey. He was kind of surprised that I didn't run him off, as I guess a lot of other cops have in the past, but I figured he had as much right to utilize the area as anyone else and he wasn't hurting the area. He was actually causing a whole lot less damage than the people who were tearing it up on their 4 wheelers and complaining about him. So that began my pseudo-acquaintanceship with the man named Smokey.

    Smokey walks a route every day. When he gets up, he makes his breakfast and then leaves his camp whenever the time is right, for him. He hits the river at an undisclosed location (for privacy) and cleans himself and his clothes up. After his morning ablutions, he heads out for the rest of his trip. Smokey's normal first stop, of all places, is the library. He drops off the book he read and selects a new one. Then he heads off to the post office. He actually has a post office box. The post office box and library card are some reasons he is only partly "Off the grid." He checks his mail, and believe it or not, picks up a pension check once a month. (No, he's never told me what his pension is for.) Following the post office, it's a short walk to his bank. Yes, Smokey has a banking account and the final reason he's not truly "Off the grid." (Makes me wonder what the guy is really worth considering his Spartan lifestyle.) He makes a deposit once a month and gets the money he needs for his grocery shopping. Off to McDonald's for a cup of hot Joe. He then heads to the grocers and grabs what he wants for lunch, dinner, and the following day's breakfast. Probably spends less than $5.00 to $7.00 a day on food. Mostly house brand canned goods and a few pieces of fruit and maybe some vegetables to spice up his stew. After that, he stops by my buddy's gas station and he fills up his water bottles and a 1 gallon milk jug with water. Occasionally, he'll ask my buddy if he can purchase a discarded automotive part or scrap that he may be throwing away or discarded cardboard. Always what my friend would consider garbage, but Smokey will have an idea for something that he can make out of an old oil filter, brake rotor, or whatever, to make his life slightly more comfortable. He uses the cardboard to insulate himself from the ground and makes sort of a pallet to sleep on. AFTER all that, he follows some railroad tracks home and scavenges for whatever he sees that may be helpful. I think that's where he finds coal occasionally. I'm sure he's not stealing from passing hopper cars as the Railroad Dicks would toss him in the gray bar hilton if he did. Then back to his camp where he settles in for the rest of the day and night, reading his book.

    Smokey is constantly scavenging. It's nothing to see him walking down a sidewalk and something will catch his eye. He'll inspect it, give it some thought, and either secure it in a pocket or backpack, or leave it, and continue his journey. Whenever I'd see him or check on him, which I did often during the winter, I'd just kind of eyeball his gear. Even when the weather was below zero, smokey could be found, snug as a bug, out of the wind and snow, never in distress. Pretty amazing guy.

    From what I can glean, his pocket carry consisted mainly of a decent quality Boy Scout style folding knife, with can opener, a couple of blades, and a bottle opener. Kind of like a SAK but a bit more robust with stag handles. In addition to the knife, he also has a beat up, off brand, leatherman type tool that most of the tool bits are broken and a pair of regular old pliers. I've only seen him use the pliers on the leatherman to cut wire or pull his cook set off the stove when it was hot. I assume he uses them with the other pliers when constructing things. He also keeps a "Church Key" in his pocket. I don't know what they're really called but it's a piece of metal we used a lot when I was a kid to pierce triangular holes in cans of Hi-C on one end and to open pop bottles with the other. I also remember using them to open old school cans of motor oil. I guess, before my time, you used them to open beer cans as well, hence the name "Church Key" for when people would hold "Choir Practice" after work. It's the "Original" pocket pry tool. He also keeps a lighter, usually a Bic, that when I asked, Smokey said he could usually find laying around in the parking lot of a convenience store. He also had an ancient, broken piece of ferro rod that I saw him handling once but Smokey said it was rarely used. In addition to his pocket carry stuff, his existence is pretty spartan. He had a pretty elaborate stove and cooking set up made out of repurposed and modified tin cans and bailing wire he found on the side of the roadway. It consisted of a small can which he used as a cup, a slightly larger can for cooking in, and a bigger can that was a "hobo stove." It all nested together nicely. He uses a couple of 1L bottles to carry with him for water as well as a 1 gallon milk jug to store water in. In addition, he had a couple of nice quality, but well used wool blankets, some other odds and ends, and whatever cordage he can find laying around and bailing wire. He also has a tarp made of an unknown cloth material, looked like cotton, but he somehow had sort of oiled or waxed it. He uses it as a poncho when the weather's bad secured with some cordage. I was about 5'x7' open and folded up nicely into about a 1'X1'X3" square. He had several pairs of decent socks, a set of long johns, and a super worn Carhart work coat all of which I assume he gets from the thrift shop. In the winter, he also has some insulated Carhart pants. A battered ball cap in the summer and a wool hat in the winter. That was about it. He must have some gloves or mittens but I've never noticed them. Everything else Smokey needs, he constructs along the way using those simple items and scavenged, discarded junk. I bet his whole kit, less the water and canned goods weighed less than 10 pounds.

    Anyway, after all that, I have to ask myself: What do I really "Need" for EDC vs. what do I "want"? Maybe I'll build my own "Hobo" kit for a scenario such as Ben describes. Might be an interesting exercise. No, not going to go live under a bridge if I can help it.
     
    Troy, WinonaRail, Jerry D. and 10 others like this.
  17. Ben Rubinstein

    Ben Rubinstein
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Grand Master

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2016
    Messages:
    1,758
    Likes Received:
    12,763
    That was fascinating! Thank you for sharing!
     
    Firefly, Jack, Gallows and 2 others like this.
  18. Ben Rubinstein

    Ben Rubinstein
    Expand Collapse
    EDC Grand Master

    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2016
    Messages:
    1,758
    Likes Received:
    12,763
    I'm interested as to whether you think a 'refugee' plan is actually necessary in the US? There are two usual scenario's which cause a refugee crisis, natural disasters and war. Being a massive island the latter is far less of a worry, even those worrying about 'government gone rabid' would be thinking either dig in or get out rather than hit the road in a mass of moving humanity (where would you go? there isn't another country to flee to). The first option is far more likely but again it is unlikely to cause a full on refugee crisis unless you live in a danger zone (or indeed in LA :eek: ). In any case I think the BoB and prepping of the States is fully valid for the States, just not so much for outside. I think in the States you will be far more in danger of your fellow citizens than the authorities when law and order breaks down and that is a very worrying thought that you have to be prepared for. It certainly makes for very different bag contents than that of a potential refugee in Europe for example.

    What I find very valid about your point is that there is a 'head for the hills' type bag and a 'let's survive in an urban environment' type bag. I have often thought that the safest people in an urban disaster type situation will be the homeless. You may get kicked, you may have the pathetic contents of your bags strewn all over the ground by unkind authority figures or gang members or whatever - but you won't be seen as a threat. You won't be shot. You're a comical figure, a figure of disgust, a figure barely noticed. And that way you might well survive. Proud armies may come and go but the homeless who have given up on pride, will probably outlive them all.
     
    Jack, A4VC, Gallows and 3 others like this.
  19. RiderOnTheStorm

    RiderOnTheStorm
    Expand Collapse
    Apocalypse Ready

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2016
    Messages:
    2,544
    Likes Received:
    27,997
    I think it goes to show how truly little you need in order to survive in an urban environment.
     
    Old Army Guy, Firefly, Jack and 4 others like this.
  20. RiderOnTheStorm

    RiderOnTheStorm
    Expand Collapse
    Apocalypse Ready

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2016
    Messages:
    2,544
    Likes Received:
    27,997

    I can't imagine a refugee situation, but it could be possible in most extreme cases such as nuclear fallout. You have a few choices depending on your location, head for Canada, if a viable option, or head south to Mexico or even beyond to central or South America.

    If you're like me, stuck in Southwest Florida, then it becomes tricky to get to Mexico on foot, as you have to head north first then west, then south, unless you have access to a boat, sailboat. Definitely not something I've put a lot of thought into. Mostly we're thinking about evacuation routes due to Hurricanes, and even that has it's own complications.
     
    Firefly, Jack, Ben Rubinstein and 2 others like this.

Share This Page